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    WikiProject iconThis page is used for the administration of the Articles for Creation or Files for Upload processes and is therefore within the scope of WikiProject Articles for Creation. Please direct any queries to the discussion page.Articles for creationWikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creationTemplate:WikiProject Articles for creation (admin)AfC project pagesWikiProject icon
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    Backlog drives[edit]

    Is another backlog drive being planned? I missed the last two so I'm not sure if there was a set schedule put into place or if they occur whenever. Status has been on 3+ months for a while. C F A 💬 20:31, 25 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    Usually ad-hoc, and usually when we get towards 5mo. I honestly think that unless we start tickling 4mo we're in a good place, as long as the numbers don't keep creeping up to quickly. Mildly related, it's interesting how we can have 2-4 new reviewers added per week and yet the backlog increase rate never seems to drop... Primefac (talk) 11:33, 26 May 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I am guessing the amount of reviewers added are equal to the amount of editors who quit/take a wikibreak reviewing, like I did for few months. I like AfC reviewing since it brings articles to mainspace, but it is hard to keep a motivation in this largely thank-less task. Ca talk to me! 13:43, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    Declined article appearing in Mainspace[edit]

    If an article gets declined at AfC but then is immediately created in Mainspace (and has problems), per Caroline Leon, what is the process? Can it be automatically re-sent back to Draft/AfC or does it have to go to AfD? thanks. Aszx5000 (talk) 12:12, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    If it was moved from draft, then move it back if you think it has a chance of being improved. Or you can improve it yourself. If no chance of becoming an article, then use speedy delete nominations, or AFD as appropriate. Graeme Bartlett (talk) 12:26, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    (edit conflict) See WP:ATD-I. I would argue that that article doesn't meet the criteria though as it's been widely edited - and there is a claim to notability in there. It's certainly not a clear delete !vote to me at AfD, so I think it's best to either send it there or work on improving it. I'm not a fan of moving articles back from articlespace once they've been moved there anyway as it gets messy quickly. Mdann52 (talk) 12:27, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    it was draftified once before. Conservatively, per WP:DRAFTOBJECT, it shouldn't be draftified again, unless it is a UPE editor. However, what I could determine is there is a conflict of interest at the most. So either AfD or improve the article. – robertsky (talk) 12:28, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Thanks all. It is a problem in the WPClimbing project of BLPs that have no notability as climbers (they never appear in any climbing media) but because they paid $50k to climb Everest (or Seven Summits etc.), they get some local non-climbing coverage, and then a UPE article appears in WP as PROMO for their public speaking / business coaching activities (although. I think the AfC reviewer made the correct call, but obviously the editor know that they can just by-pass it. Aszx5000 (talk) 13:12, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    If necessary request a {{histmerge}}. Primefac (talk) 20:04, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    Uw-paid[edit]

    I constantly find that new editors misunderstand the paid-editing warning, esp. when they're writing about their employer rather than a client. I raised this on the template's talk page a few months ago, didn't get anywhere, so have opened an edit request at Template_talk:Uw-paid1#Edit_request_7_June_2024. Feel free to add your views there. (Sorry, should have mentioned this earlier but clean forgot.) Thanks, -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 14:36, 12 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    Drafts Nominated for Deletion[edit]

    At Miscellany for Deletion, we sometimes see drafts that are nominated for deletion for lack of notability, or for some other reason that is applicable to articles but not to drafts. These nominations are made in good faith, but are undesirable because they bite the originator of the draft, and are a waste of time for the MFD regulars. I would sort of like to know how to minimize the number of these nominations. I have in particular wondered whether they are made by new New Page Patrol volunteers who are looking at new entries in draft space, rather than at new entries in article space. I understand that a quick check of new entries in draft space is useful to verify that they are not attack pages or vandalism, but those are among the few things that new drafts should be checked against.

    So I have occasionally asked a nominator what their reason was for nominating a draft for deletion (as well as, of course, saying Keep). One of my concerns is whether clearer instructions to NPP reviewers are needed about draft space. All that is prologue. I have assumed that AFC reviewers understand draft space, and know that there are five main choices that they have with regard to drafts:

    • Accept the draft.
    • Leave the draft alone for another reviewer, maybe with comments.
    • Decline the draft for possible improvement.
    • Reject the draft (which should be done seldom compared to accept and decline).
    • Tag the draft for speedy deletion, whether as spam or for some other reason (which should be done seldom compared to accept and decline).

    We know that drafts can be nominated for deletion at MFD, but that should only be done in rare cases, mainly for tendentious resubmission.

    So, after that prologue, here is my question. There is a draft at MFD that was nominated for deletion by an AFC reviewer as crystal balling. It will be kept, but I think that its nomination was a mistake. Is this a case where an AFC reviewer didn't understand something, and where maybe clearer instructions are needed? Robert McClenon (talk) 18:36, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Draft:2025 in animation I assume? Got any concrete proposals for what you'd like done? Are you proposing we add "Drafts should not be nominated at MFD for violating WP:NOTCRYSTAL" to one of the NPP/AFC/MFD pages? –Novem Linguae (talk) 19:26, 18 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    User:Novem Linguae - Yes, that's the case in point. I am thinking of adding something more general to the AFC pages, and maybe the NPP pages, something to the effect of:
    There are six options with regard to drafts:
    • Accept the draft.
    • Decline the draft for possible improvement, possibly with additional comments for the author.
    • Leave the draft for another review, possibly with comments.
    • Reject the draft, which should be done less often than either accept or decline.
    • Tag the draft for speedy deletion, whether as spam or for some other reason, which should be done less often than either accept or decline.
    • Nominate the draft for deletion at MFD, only in special cases, such as tendentious resubmission, and not for reasons of notability or sanity.
    The issue is not really any one reason why drafts should not be nominated for deletion, but that nominating a draft for deletion should be done rarely.
    Another bad reason why drafts are nominated for deletion is that there is already an article, but I think that is taken care of by speedy redirection. Robert McClenon (talk) 19:51, 19 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I'm not really sure I agree that we need this list posted somewhere; these are pretty much all of the options available, and without them being numbered there isn't a definite "priority" and even if we say "do these less than the others" people won't notice and/or won't care: with it being "an option" it's fair game. Personally I don't really think drafts should be G11'd either, as it's a PITA when someone comes into IRC looking for help with their draft and it turns out it's been deleted so I can't even point out why it's a problematic page.
    In other words, I don't think increasing our how-to should change if what we're really looking to do is have a philosophical change with how people view and interact with drafts. If we don't want people MFD'ing drafts except in the most egregious of circumstances (which would likely require speedy deletion anyway) then we should make it possible (and/or easier) to speedy-close MFD'd drafts (almost like an anti-CSD criteria). Primefac (talk) 00:20, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    Template:AfC submission/draft[edit]

    Tracked in github.com
    Issue #240

    When an article is draftified, we typically need to manually insert the subjected template". IMO, there should be an option to add this template using the AFC script. — Saqib (talk I contribs) 13:07, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    @Saqib: the User:MPGuy2824/MoveToDraft script adds that template automatically. -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 13:18, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    DoubleGrazing, OK, but the AFC script should include this functionality as well. When articles are moved instead of draftified, the template still needs to be added manually. — Saqib (talk I contribs) 13:22, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Are you referring to the WP:AFCH script? It moves drafts to mainspace, not articles to draftspace, so I'm not sure I understand the suggestion. –Novem Linguae (talk) 21:12, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Novem Linguae, I'm just suggesting that we include an option in this WP:AFCH script to insert template Template:AfC submission/draft or Template:Draft article. — Saqib (talk I contribs) 07:05, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I agree with Novem, AFCH is for accepting drafts and dealing with pages already in the pipeline; it's still a single edit and typing out {{afc submission/draft}} isn't that onerous. Primefac (talk) 22:01, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Ah, I see what you mean. I really like this idea. I even wrote a patch for it one time, but there was an objection so I had to abandon it. If folks want this I am happy to revive the patch. –Novem Linguae (talk) 15:51, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Novem Linguae, Yes please do. — Saqib (talk I contribs) 15:54, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I think it would be better to add the more generic {{Draft article}}, as AfC is not mandatory. – Joe (talk) 13:26, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    As mentioned on Github, this seems like scopecreep for the AFCH script. Mdann52 (talk) 16:30, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    Change proposal regarding AfC requirement for COI[edit]

    Hello,

    I would like to raise attention to a discussion started in the Village Pump regarding potential changes to WP:COI which currently requires any paid editor (including the ones receiving grants from non-profit organizations) to go through AfC for all new articles. I thought this might be of interest to AfC reviewers, as a change of policy would substantially reduce the AfC volume.

    7804j (talk) 11:59, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    Too short[edit]

    @North8000 said something at WT:N, in a different context, about wanting articles to have at least a bit of content (maybe a couple sentences or an image), and this has reminded me that I have a question about an item in Wikipedia:WikiProject Articles for creation/Reviewing instructions#Step 3: Suitability, "too short".

    This item in the reviewing instructions says "Too short, but could be merged into Article" and "Decline the submission as too short and suggest a suitable title for the content to be merged into (if applicable). Generally, the author should be able to do this themselves."

    My question: What's too short?

    Let's say that the median Wikipedia article today contains n sentences of readable prose. What's the minimum? Does it need to be 50% as long as the median? At least as long as the median? Longer than the median? Are all stubs (generally, <250 words or <10 sentences) too short? Do reviewers all use the same standard? Does anyone even know? WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:07, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    This decline rationale is designed for something like paragraph-long statements about a subject, but there is an existing article where that content could just as easily be added as a stand-alone section (or even as part of an existing section). In other words, this isn't really for all short submissions (we do accept stubs), but more for the ones of questionable notability where it would be a lot easier to just fold it into something that already exists.
    As an arbitrary/hypothetical example, let's say we have University of Coolness, which has an article. Someone writes a draft about the School of Awesome, which is located at the UoC, but the draft itself is only about a paragraph long (though properly sourced). That would probably fall into this category of "short but could be merged", as it's not really long enough (or notable enough) to have its own article, but would be served reasonably well as a section on the main University's article (ostensibly with a redirect pointing to that section). Primefac (talk) 21:17, 22 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Perhaps it would be better to rename it to something like "Could be easily merged". That way nobody gets the idea that length is a requirement. WhatamIdoing (talk) 22:52, 23 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    That's... exactly what the merge decline says... The proposed article does not have sufficient content to require an article of its own, but it could be merged into the existing article on the same subject. Since anyone can edit Wikipedia, you are welcome to add that information yourself. Thank you. Primefac (talk) 00:08, 24 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    See [1] WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:14, 24 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I also wonder whether this is the right approach. If the subject is notable, then why not accept the draft and immediately tag it for merging? WhatamIdoing (talk) 15:47, 24 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Usually these aren't yet shown to be notable. Rather than declining the article and sending the editor back through some unknown number of revise-and-declines, the merge decline tells them how to get their content onto wikipedia immediately, by editing another article. -- asilvering (talk) 16:26, 24 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Is "shown to be notable" a requirement? WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:44, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    For AfC acceptance? Yes. For merging? No. Hence my comment. -- asilvering (talk) 01:16, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    AFC is supposed to accept articles that will survive at AFD (right?).
    AFD does not require that subjects be "shown" to be notable (though it certainly helps).
    So... maybe AFC shouldn't actually have such a requirement, at least in theory? WhatamIdoing (talk) 04:01, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    AfC reviewers are not obligated to do a full WP:BEFORE search that is expected of someone nominating an article for AfD. So an article needs to be shown to be notable to get through AfC, unless the reviewer goes out of their way to find and add some more sources (as I do often for books and profs articles, where notability is clear to me even in absence of sources in the draft). -- asilvering (talk) 05:32, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Any editor can help improve an article, of course, and Wikipedia is built on that sort of voluntary collaboration.
    For a subject whose notability is clear to you (e.g., due to your personal knowledge), do you feel like the sources really must be added before you could move the draft to the mainspace? Do you feel like it would be a violation of the rules if you instead (e.g., because you didn't have the time right now) moved it to the mainspace and tagged it as {{sources exist}} or {{more refs}}? WhatamIdoing (talk) 17:43, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Just noting, if one knows the subject is notable, then the reviewer in a way has done a sort of BEFORE. I think the assumption here is that the reviewer has no familiarity with the subject, and thus has the not-unreasonable option of declining a draft that does not appear (based on given references and text) to be notable. Primefac (talk) 19:23, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I agree. I'm asking this because Asilvering often goes out of their way to find and add some more sources for some books and profs articles whose notability is already obvious to them. Are they doing this because they feel that adding the sources is actually required, or just because they want to? WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:43, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Precisely, Primefac. We cannot expect reviewers to go out of their way to determine notability before accepting AfC drafts. The backlog is long enough as it is. My reasons for adding sources that show notability are completely irrelevant to the question at hand. -- asilvering (talk) 22:47, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I don't think it's irrelevant.
    If you are adding them because you're nice, then thank you!
    If you're adding them because you believe that it's required by AFC's rules, then maybe we should talk about whether AFC's rules are correct. WhatamIdoing (talk) 22:56, 27 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    This has been discussed before. Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Articles for creation/Archive 54#Google searches when reviewing? –Novem Linguae (talk) 01:10, 28 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    I like your edit. I also think this is the right approach. If a draft comes to AfC and you think it shouldn't be a mainspace article then I think the better solution has to be to decline it, rather than accept it then send it to another forum to try to remove it again.
    I also agree with asilvering that it is helpful to encourage new editors to improve existing articles rather than them focussing only on creating new ones from scratch. Mgp28 (talk) 17:10, 24 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Wouldn't this create an unnecessary duplicate of an existing article? I think the status quo of keeping content that needs merging in draftspace is fine. –Novem Linguae (talk) 08:37, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    If it gets merged, then theoretically we need the original/draft in the mainspace, for licensing purposes. AIUI this isn't legally required if all merged copyrighted content are also from the editor who does the merge (or if you follow one of the pre-approved alternative processes), but it is normal. WhatamIdoing (talk) 19:46, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Edit looks good. I didn't realize the AFC page said this (I thought you were talking about the decline reasons in the template). The AFC page was probably just out of date. –Novem Linguae (talk) 08:34, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    If the article is very short and there an obvious place to merge it to than I think that the merge would be a good idea. (and of course, if it fails wp:notability a separate article is not an option) But structurally, the official AFC pass criteria is a reasonable likelihood of surviving at AFD. And for credible candidates that criteria will typically be wp:notability. Actual AFC practice is that articles commonly get declined for other reasons and various template wordings contribute to that. So IMO, while a good plan, such should not be a decline reason.
    My comment that you led with (I'm flattered :-)) was intended for a possible new SNG which was for a special case Where the accepted defacto notability bar is very low and greenlights millions of species that don't currently have articles. North8000 (talk) 15:35, 24 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    Discussion at Wikipedia:Edit filter/Requested § {{AfC submission}}[edit]

     You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia:Edit filter/Requested § {{AfC submission}}. '''[[User:CanonNi]]''' (talk • contribs) 03:43, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    How would someone call for a review of a probationary reviewer?[edit]

    As per the title really, looked at a draft of an article that's "under review" and instead of making a decision the probationary reviewer (Ae245) has instead chosen to attempt to add biographical material to it from a clearly non-reputable source (thebiography.org).[2]

    The site's "about" page alone screams "low grade" with numerous basic grammar mistakes[3] Rambling Rambler (talk) 23:05, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    I think the first step is not to immediately call for them to be removed from the project; discuss the matter with them and see where they are coming from and if they appear receptive to the (hopefully constructive) criticism of their edits. Obviously, if that does not yield positive results, then a review can be done by me or any other admin who feels comfortable making that decision. If said admin does not remove and you do not agree (and/or said admin says more discussion is needed) then bringing it here for a wider project-based review is probably the best bet. You can, of course, come straight here for a wider project review, but please make sure that you let the reviewer in question know about the discussion so they can participate (on the off chance they don't watch this page or missed the discussion being posted). Primefac (talk) 23:19, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    @Primefac thanks for the reply, I'll leave a message on their talk page. Have to say though I'm very surprised at what I found given they added clearly unsuitable sources to establish WP:BLP material and then deemed the article acceptable for mainspace[4]. Rambling Rambler (talk) 23:26, 29 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    AFC Script comment on originator of draft[edit]

    Tracked in github.com
    Issue #361

    The AFC script provides a comment if the originator of a draft is blocked, stating the duration of the draft, and the reason given by the administrator. I think that it needs one tweak. If the originator is partially blocked, it says that they are blocked, not that they are partially blocked. For instance, you can see this with Draft:Burnett Township, Santa Clara County, California. Robert McClenon (talk) 02:58, 30 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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